E- System Thinking and the Primacy of Relations

1) W. Ross Ashby, “Principles of the Self Organizing System”, in von Foerster, Heinz, ed., Principles of Self-Organization, Pergamon Press, 1962.

William

Could we discuss Ashby’s role in cybernetics? His work is extremely self-referential, and feels incomplete.  Is this a condensed version of a more complete work?

Rob-

1.      On page 258, Ashby states that “properties [are] not intrinsic to the thing but are relational between the observer and thing.”  Could this statement be related to the concept of feedback?

2.      It seems that a lot of authors on this type of subject like to create equations to show relationships between things that cannot necessarily have quantifiable values.  I understand that they are trying to show relationships, but it seems as if the relationships could be made easier to understand if they were defined more through network or arrow diagrams than through equations.  Is there a reason why equations are favored over diagrams?

3.      On page 271, Ashby argues that simple systems are not as interesting as complex systems.  Couldn’t it be argued that these complex systems are just a series of simple systems and that those simple systems are therefore more important and interesting to fully comprehend?

Yuan-

1. How to understand the term “product space” when different observers will use different product spaces on page 258?

2. Does the criteria of determine whether it is good organization or bad organization purely goal oriented?

2) Jack Burnham, “Systems Esthetics”, Artforum, September 1968.

Rob-

1.      By using so many names and not explaining any of the theories that go along with the names, it seems as if the author has a very small target audience.

2.      Who would be the audience for a work like this?  Is there a target group?

3.      I don’t really understand the connection Burnham is getting at in the second paragraph of the second page when he says “a striking parallel exists between the ‘new’ car of the automobile stylist and the syndrome of formalist invention in art…”

Yuan-

1. How does the “boundary situation” works under mass reproduction presented in Haacke’s paragraph?

2. Why the theater is categorized to “high art”?

William

How does Burnham’s discussion of systemic production fit into Walter Benjamin’s discussion of reproduction? Can a system be reproduced? What about aura?